Transcribed by: Jonelle Boateng, London Allen

Zoe: Hey, everyone. Welcome to a very special, not Christmas episode of Lemon-Aid. I’m Zoe, your host. 

London: I’m London. I’m very excited for this episode, we’ve got a lot of not Christmas holidays to talk about and I’m excited to share that with you guys. 

Zoe: Bethany is not able to make it tonight, but we hope that she has an amazing holiday and she’s a really cool person so yup, okay. So we did plan some traditions. 

London: We were talking about um, Christmas dinners and how you didn’t know it was a thing. 

Zoe: Yes! 

London: We actually have Christmas dinner every year, but we decided because this year we hosted thanksgiving so my aunt is hosting christmas. So I don’t have to make anything for Christmas dinner and I’m so excited about that. If you like your family, it’s nice. 

Zoe: Christmas breakfast was always just like, it was my mom and I and then it was like her parents and then sometimes like after my cousins were born then we go over to like my aunt's house. And that was that. And like it was it was fun and all whatever I don’t know it was very short-lived because obviously it’s breakfast. It’s super easy to cook, you’re in you’re out, you leave them with the dishes. You’re good to go. That’s that. 

London: Then you have the rest of your day. 

Zoe: Yeah, exactly. And it wasn’t even like we do anything like big and fancy for Christmas breakfast by any means, it was like scrambled eggs and toast and like the most basic like diner style breakfast that you could imagine. Little bit of bacon, you know, whatever, you know that that was it. 

London: I think the pressure to like have a big meal on holidays is kind of a lot. And I mention that because it’s already kind of a lot for I’d say me because I don’t like - I have a history of like , just issues with like eating and stuff so I need to overeat on a holiday. So I like that idea of like not having to have a big dinner in, you know, when you’re eating in a group setting like that, people tend to watch your plate and watch what you eat and comment on it and literally, literally so bad. 

Zoe: Yeah, yeah, for sure. Well and I think especially just like - there’s so much, so many unnecessary comments that come along with that, where at least like with breakfast and like a very limited like amount of - not like limited amount of food, but like limited options I guess cause it’s like toast, eggs, bac- like whatever you know. If you’re just like “Oh I don’t really want that” it’s like okay whatever. Like there’s only five different options so it’s usually not that bad. 

London: Yeah, less pressure for sure. 

Zoe: Yeah, which is really cool. Umm, yeah, yeah. I’ve always liked it. We’ve always done like odd traditions like that where it’s like we’ll do like a christmas cheese plate. Like what the f***? Like you know, Christmas cocktails and all that. So I think taking some of the traditional things and flipping them on their head has always been fun, but also I think coming from like a very non-traditional like family structure where it’s just the two of us, it makes things so much easier, it really does. There’s a lot of privilege in that I think. 

London: I mean and I get that. For a little bit, it was just me and my mom. I always feel like when it’s just me and my mom it’s much less pressure. And ever since we’ve been like more family oriented again in the last couple of years. It’s just been kind of a lot. 

Zoe: So yeah. Just along with that, there’s such a craze about Christmas and Christmas ideals and all of that. And I think so one of the things that shocked me when I moved to Los Angeles coming from Iowa and I was like very Christian very Christmasy like I don’t know, like the epicenter of like the Starbucks cup how awful that was. Not necessarily, not actually, but like a lot of people there were really mad about it. And I remember when I moved to Los Angeles, there’s so many minoras, they’re all over. And they lit them up along with, you know, every day of Hanukkah and all of that and I thought that was really, really, really neat because I never, like that was just never a thing. And I always thought that was really cool and like it seems like kind of moving out of that rural shit hole, if I may. It’s interesting seeing how the Christmas craze is. 

London: And it’s like crazy to see just like every year, like it will come off so quickly in October and obviously will be focused mainly towards Christmas. And obviously it’s like a catch, grab because Christmas is so centered around capitalism. You know, the idea of consumption and just, you know what that says about you know, the world at large ,who’s taking this holiday. And I think it’s interesting also how Christmas has just become a cultural phenomenon.

Zoe: Yeah 

London: And just how that ties into like everything about being such a craze but then at the end of the day, there’s these other holidays that just get pushed to the side. And I don’t know if you’ve ever seen the show, “New Girl”

Zoe: Mmhm

London: And there’s a character in it who’s jewish and he talks about in one episode, remember how all the jewish kids couldn’t tell the christian kids that Santa wasn’t real. And I thought that was really funny. But it’s just like interesting to think about what the kids who don’t celebrate Christmas go through. And like their perspective on things and I just feel like they probably feel left out. I know I would if I didn’t celebrate Christmas. And you know, everyone comes back from break and they’re like “What did you get? What did you get?” And you’re like “Well I don’t celebrate Christmas” It that doesn’t even have to mean that you’re jewish cause I know, you know you still get gifts and stuff. You know, people that just don’t participate in that. 

Zoe: Yeah, yeah. I mean I even think too, I saw this this tweet the other day and I was like “God, I didn’t even think about that” But it was like if you give your kid gifts from Santa, do not give them expensive sh*t because when they turn around and go back to school and they’re like “oh Santa got me a brand new iPad” or “a brand new phone” or blah blah blah and like if there’s another family who can’t afford that, they’re like “why the f*** did Santa get me like a pair of socks?” or you know, like a hairbrush or like something like that too. And I think there’s much to be said about like the commercialization of Santa but then also like “the best gift comes come from him” and it’s like take credit for that because like you’re gonna make a lot of kids feel really sh*tty and there’s you know especially when I just think of like the main question that you get when you go back to school isn’t anything related to like “Oh what’d you do over the holiday?” It was like “What did you get for Christmas?” I would totally feel left out too. 

London: There’s this pressure with Christmas and it kind of forces, you know, those kids who don’t have it to kind of grow up a little bit quicker in a way because if their parents can’t afford it, they can’t live under this like fairytale of like “Santa’s real” because their parents have to be real with them and explain to them like “Hey, we don’t have it” And I feel like that also ties into the whole pressure that comes with celebrating Christmas and the emphasis on consumption, gifts instead of you know, anything meaningful, like spending time with your family or any religious ties that people have with the holiday. 

Zoe: Yeah, I um-so I nanny outside of doing my work at NB and I was overhearing this conversation of like these couple kids. And one of them was like ”Oh my gosh, you don’t celebrate Christmas? Like that’s crazy, like I just can’t even imagine.” and like what another kid was like, and I’m so glad that she was absolutely like not even entertaining it, but like she was like ”What’s so good about Christmas that’s not good about like any other holiday?” and I like, I had to stop myself from laughing cause there was just like, yeah that’s exactly it. Like I don’t know why we have decided that like Christmas is like “The thing” And the ways in which like we market that are like it’s just, it’s very capitalistic and like very predatory in the way that like we talk about it because it’s so far removed from like, I don’t know what Christmas I guess it’s like supposed to be. 

London: And to tie into that idea of like christmasy capitalism, there’s more to be said about how every holiday special revolves around - or at least the popular ones - revolves around Christmas. You never really see any other, you know, thing mentioned except foreshadow to “The Proud Family” for Kwanzaa, but we’ll get into that later. But no, there’s just a lot to be said because it’s like you have this representation and it’s so much representation in there. And it just reminds me of like other aspects where the majority issue is just always represented. And it’s just like even if the majority isn’t these kids who may not celebrate Christmas or who may celebrate a different holiday, like they deserve to see their holidays being spoken about, they deserve to see, you know, some form of media where, you know, see themselves in that and just to see like their experiences in that and not always have to be surrounded by this holiday special centered purely around Christmas. And nine times out of ten, it’s purely around gift giving, you know?

Zoe: Yeah, yeah. I even just think of like how many hallmark movies, like I think - what was it? Like this year or last year, they finally had the first hallmark Christmas movie that came out that was a gay couple. And I was just like, “I love to see it” And it took them, how many f*cking movies later? Like that’s your thing and you know, I even think of like the media of Christmas and all of that too like I genuinely, besides “Proud Family”, cannot think of anything where it is not a white family who celebrates Christmas.

London: I know there’s some to that, no I’m not gonna say some. I feel like I’ve at least seen one. And it’s because Christmas sells and it’s like Christmas is a capitalistic season. They know to capitalize off of that. 

Zoe: Yeah, yeah. I thought of one more. F*cking “Big Mouth”. They do, they have a holiday episode, but then they also have one where one of the main kids celebrates Hanukkah. And like it’s deals with like, just how left out he feels and how he like just wishes that he could like not be Jewish and like what that means. Which I think was a really interesting take and I’m glad that they did that, but it’s also the same show that like literally the next episode they showed Santas balls, so like take it with a grain of salt. 

London: Yeah, even going into how that kid felt left out in “Big Mouth” just goes into how so many spaces, so many holiday celebrations are essentially Christmas parties like at work spaces and all these other spaces. Schools, too, also do this. Where they have Christmas parties, which I think is really, really sh*t. Even though it’s marketed as a “holiday party”, it’s essentially a Christmas party. Shoutout to those who celebrate Kwanzaa and still participate in a productive world when you shouldn’t have to, you should be able to enjoy your holiday. It’s just so much to be said about that, about this organization of the system where we get off for this holiday so you can’t really call it a holiday break because you get on break for Christmas, it’s a Christmas break. 

Zoe: Yeah. And I think especially just like the fact of so many businesses like won’t even allow people to take that space off and like I mean even schools the fact you get you get winter break, but like winter break is centered around Christmas. And so, you know, what does it mean for people who don’t celebrate that. Again you shouldn’t have in those spaces, like you said, like it’s not negotiable. If people who celebrate Christmas don’t have to work during Christmas, then why the fuck does anyone else have to work. I’m getting into, again, just like people that get really angry whenever these ideas are brought up because there’s always that one person that’s just like weirdly irate. I even think of the whole argument of like “The war on Christmas” and how like “Christmas is dying” and all these things and it’s like okay, again, Christmas is already dead because we capitalize the fuck out of it, but I’m also like, there’s so many other things that we need to be paying attention to like other holidays and other things that we could be aware of. 

London: The moment that Coca-cola made Santa Claus a capitalist figure, Christmas died. So y’all can take y’all argument and kiss my a*s because if you were really the religious soldier, saint you claim to be, you wouldn’t even celebrate Christmas in the form that you do. 

Zoe: So I was supposed to do research into other, other traditions. The one that I am really going to focus on because it brings me joy and I think it’s fun is Krampus. I feel like Krampus has gotten a little bit more recognized recently. There’s also the movie that came out and I feel like now everyone is just like “That’s crazy”, but like a lot of people also think that like Krampus is like a relative of Santa and he’s not, actually Krampus just happens to come from white countries and like Santa came from white countries. And you know, everything just gets mixed up. But he is from Alpine folklore and his whole thing is that he will show up in the middle of the night and take the children who have misbehaved. 

London: I love that. 

Zoe: You know what, I’m not even gonna try to pronounce it because it is not, I cannot, I can barely even talk, myself. But, traditional Krampus nights where Krampus goes to visit everyone is December 5th. So it happens quite a bit before Christmas, but usually children will leave gifts such as like oranges, dried fruits, chocolate, walnuts and that’s if you’re good and that reminds Krampus that you’ve been a good child this year. Krampus is also the son of Hell, the Norse god of the underworld, just by the way. When Christianity became like the thing, that’s when Krampus became associated with Christmas, despite the Catholic Church wanting to ban Krampus from being associated with Christmas. But he and Saint Nicolas, which is not the same as Santa actually, but Saint Nicolas became Santa, it’s a whole thing. They both arrive on December 5th and then Saint Nicolas would give the good children presents and Krampus would beat them…beat the naughty kids with branches and sticks and then take them to the underworld. It’s a fun time, but Krampus was most popular, I think, I don’t know how popular it is today, but in Austria and Germany, it was primarily were Krampus was like “The thing”. But there are a ton of just like different like festivities that people would have like doing like parades and you know dressing up in scary outfits to scare Krampus away. So yeah, that’s a little taste on Krampus. I like Krampus, I think Krampus is cool. Also just looks really fucking cool. I don’t know, something about a half man half goat just fiery demon, love to see it. So that’s my fun Christmas. I find myself trending towards like celebrating more Krampus than I do Christmas. Krampus isn't necessarily a celebration by any means, but I find myself wanting to migrate that way a little bit more. It’s just fun, it’s exciting. A demon rolling the streets, I love to see it, I do. Although my dream is if I ever end up getting a Christmas tree again, I want to find, and I have yet to find it, so if anyone who’s listening finds this, send Necessary Behavior a link, I will find it. Thank you so much, I greatly appreciate it. I want to find a realistic angel to put on top of a tree. It would be like one of the only angel tree toppers that I would ever get. I think they’re kind of tacky, but I want like a real angel, like the angels just with like a ton of eyes and like 18 wings. 

London: Oh my goodness. 

Zoe: And I think that would be so cool because it would match my little eyeball tinsel that I have. That's my Christmas tree. I do, however, I do keep one ornament usually and it’s Bella and Edward on their wedding night. That's my singular ornament. 

London: As you should. I love that, I love that idea. [INAUDIBLE] I just want to see that. I want to that realistic sh*t and not the cute bullsh*t. [INAUDIBLE] Speaking of Christmas traditions, my favorite one to celebrate is Kwanzaa. So earlier admission is that I turn to celebrate Christmas, but I will no longer be doing that after this year. The last couple of years, I started to kind of partake in Kwanzaa. And for anyone who just doesn’t know what Kwanzaa is, it’s an annual celebration of African American culture. Even though it can be celebrated by non African American and celebrated by black people in different countries too such as in the Caribbean. So it is held annually from December 26th to January 1st and everyday there is a different celebration dedicated to one of the seven principles. And I’m not going [INAUDIBLE] because this holiday draws on Swahili. So there’s a lot of Swahili language in the Kwanzaa celebration and I’m not gonna sit here and lecture on it, and I’m so sorry. The days are unity, self-determination, collective responsibility, cooperative economics, purpose, creativity and faith. And basically the whole goal of Kwanzaa is just to celebrate, you know, African culture and being African American and basically just try to, kind of find a way to connect to those roots. Since the slave trade, everything has, you know, kind of erased that for a lot of people. So it’s kind of a way to connect to our black ancestors and then also kind of still draw on, you know, African American, in which, you know we no longer have as much of a connection as we used to. The holiday also has seven symbols and these seven symbols represent different things for tying back to back to African culture. And so, I do speak on the continent as a whole, sadly just because, you know, if you know anything, a lot of African Americans lost their true heritage, where they truly came from. So all we have left to go off of is just the fact that we come from Africa, but you can’t place where specifically for a lot of us. Each of the seven symbols is meant to honor our ancestors and everything that they did. So the symbols also have different names that come from Swahili language again, not gonna butcher it. The first symbol is “The Crops”. This is fruits, vegetables and nuts. They represent the work that went into growing them from our ancestors and the crops are placed on a special mat for everyone to enjoy and serve as a reminder as fruits that nourished the people of Africa. And they are placed on a place mat, which is the second symbol. And this is “The Straw Mat”. And it is the base for the six symbols. It’s where all six symbols lay. It symbolizes the foundation and it’s just where all the gifts of Kwanzaa are placed. The next symbol is an “Ear of Corn”. And one ear of corn is placed on the mat for each child present. One really big thing in Kwanzaa is the idea of children being the future. And so there’s really emphasis on the children. I really like that idea, it’s really cute. And then the next symbol is the gifts. On January 1st, handmade, educational and cultural gifts are given. Just to, you know, to encourage education about African culture. And then the next symbol is “The Unity Cup”. And this is the communal cup, signifying unity. And before drinking from the cup, everyone says “Harambee” meaning “Let’s pull together”. And it’s just, you know, “Unity Cup”, unity of just African American culture. And then drinking from this cup on the sixth day of Kwanzaa is meant to remember our African ancestors. And then the next symbol is “The Candleholder”. And then, of course, there’s also the seven candles that go inside the candleholder, which is another symbol. And then the seven candles are in African colors of red, green and black, symbolizing the seven principles that I mentioned earlier. And then , the seven colors also symbolize something on their own. So green symbolizes fertile land, it represents the future. Black is the color of the people, obviously because we’re black. Red represents the blood that was shed during the struggle out of slavery. And then, the way that the candles are organized, there’s three red on the right and then three green on the left and there’s one black candle in the middle to represent unity. And then there’s one candle lit each night, similar to Hanukkah. And the candles also represent how stocks of corn break off to form new stocks, which is how the human family is created. And so it also symbolizes the idea that, you know, that children represent the future and future hope for families. And so each day, families come together to light one of the candles in the candleholder and discuss the principles for the day. And then on the sixth day, December 31st, families join in a community feast, called “The Great Feast of Karamu”. Some wear traditional African clothing during the celebration and there’s decorative African projects and it’s just basically an African - just to honor just that side of us. And then, usually we’ll make African dishes with ingredients brought to us from Africa. So sweet potatoes or sesame seeds, stuff using those ingredients. Also, I forgot to mention that children usually are the ones who like cane. I really like this holiday because I feel like other than “Proud Family”, I haven’t seen it represented and I feel like even a lot of black people don’t know about it, even I didn’t get into celebrating it until the last couple of years. So I feel like it’s just a very important holiday just because it just celebrates a different culture and something different than like Christmas which is just so embedded in capitalism so for my future holiday celebration, I plan to focus on Kwanzaa because I just really enjoy the message of it and I feel like it’s really remedial to connect with your past. So that’s a little bit about Kwanzaa. And don’t be afraid to do more research and learn more about it. It’s just really a cool holiday. I wish I knew Swahili, I would’ve said the Swahili version. But I don’t, and I don’t want to butcher it. 

Zoe: I love it. So, it’s so weird because like I think that was probably like the only explanation I’ve ever got about Kwanzaa in my entire f*cking life. I’ve been so excited to learn more too, so like thank you for taking that one on. 

 London: I love it. Even in the past few years, I kind of know more about it just because I kind of, you know, taught myself some more instead of learning about it. Even so, I still have friends who will be like, who also know nothing about Kwanzaa, and they’ll ask me to explain a little bit about it. And I’m like “Yeah” because this is something we should know about, this is something that should be taught. It’s something, it’s another holiday. And I feel like this is why it’s important to learn. I feel like the school system should really emphasize learning about different cultures and I feel like during this holiday season it shouldn’t be an emphasis on like “Christmas Christmas Christmas”. There should be a little more emphasis on focusing on different types of holidays and it’ll be a really great opportunity to, you know, show different cultures and teach people about different cultures. And, you know, learning about different cultures makes people more sympathetic and it opens up people's eyes to the struggle of other people. And let them see other peoples values. And I just love it so. 

Zoe: Yeah, I think, like I always just remember Kwanzaa was always like we knew about it, you know, like okay Kwanzaa’s a thing that people celebrate but it’s like, like what is it? I know exactly why it’s not ever talked about, you know, like that’s obviously very very obvious. But, it and I really hope that more people like continue to celebrate it and like make sure that it’s something that we all know about and it’s not just like this holiday that we all know, but like have never seen it anywhere and like there’s no representation and there’s no one that like, you know, you know that celebrates Kwanzaa and everything like that and I love to see it. 

London: Even holidays, I think about. Like, I don’t know a lot about Hanukkah and I wish I knew more about that. So I think i want to make more of an effort to learn about that. 

Zoe: Especially just like again going back to what we were talking about earlier where just like Christmas is such a thing that’s so badly shoved down your throat. Throughout this entire - like I think I like the end of Halloween, arguably before Halloween, all the way through the end of the year. Like it’s hard to seek out other sources or just like other sources and just like other experiences and other holidays, you know, it’s just I wish we did better with that and I think we’re starting to kind of see that change, but like we’ve got a long ass way to go. 

London: It’s just so bad because everything is so overshadowed by Christmas. And it’s aggressive. And I would say [INAUDIBLE]

Zoe: Yeah. So I have a little bit about Hanukkah from Bethany that I’d like to share. I don’t celebrate Hanukkah, so know that. So this is again, purely researched on by Bethany, that’s that. That’s my precursor into any of this. So Hanukkah is celebrated from November 28th to December 6th and it changes every year. Mostly because the Hebrew calendar is different from the calendar that we all use. We use the solar calendar. Hebrew calendar is lunar solar. And on the Hebrew calendar it begins on the 25th day of Kislev. Ki-Kislev? If you’re editing that and I said that incorrectly, please just cut that out. Thank you. Hanukkah, which is Hebrew for dedication, is the festival of lights. It commemorates the victory the Maccabees over the Syrian, Greek army. And there’s a subsequent miracle of rededicating the holy temple in Jerusalem and restoring its minora or the lamp. The miracle of Hanukkah is that only one vile of oil was found with just enough oil to illuminate the temple lamp for one day, yet it lasted for eight full days. You celebrate Hanukkah at home by lighting the minora each night, playing dreidel and eating special food unique to Hanukkah, many of which are deep fried in oil, symbolizing oil from the minora used in the temple. These include latkes - is that how you say that? Okay. The family that I nanny for is half jewish and they always call them “Latkes”, but I’ve heard them call “Latkas” and I don’t f*cking know - latkes or latkas or potato pancakes and jelly donuts. Some people also sing Hanukkah songs or exchange gifts after lighting the minora. Yeah, so that’s a little bit about Hanukkah. Hanukkah is cool. Anything but Christmas. 

London: See that’s why it’s called the ‘Anything but Christmas’ Special. Just because of what Christmas has really been turned into. Like, I know that it’s been so much twisted than what it was originally supposed to be. I’m making an official announcement, honestly, if people can at least try to focus less on consumerism for their holiday celebrations and focus a little bit more about what that’s doing, in terms of like encouraging capitalist society, which under capitalism, the way that we practice it specifically in America just allows for such injustices just due to classism and racism and there’s so much more. And just think about what that mass consumerism does to the environment and just sustainability of it all. Take a second and think about that. 

Zoe: Wrapping up. F*ck you Christmas. Learn about other holidays. Take time, experience, do things, don’t be stupid, also and learning, just feel like I got to put that out there and happy holidays.  

London: Happy holidays. F*ck Christmas. F*ck Santa. Think a little bit past consumerism. 

Zoe: Yeah. Think about what you’re doing, why you’re doing it, who you’re doing it with. Okay, bye everyone. 

London: Bye everyone.